Agenda: Draft roadmap on the development of information technology plus eight other issues.
Transcript of the meeting
Dmitry Medvedev: Colleagues, before we get down to work, you know that a day of mourning has been declared in Moscow and the Moscow Region with regard to the terrible road accident near Podolsk on Saturday, which caused 18 casualties. This is a very large number and the dead will never come back. Please let us now observe a minute of silence in their memory.
The victims are being attended to. I know that Ms Skvortsova (Minister of Healthcare Veronica Skvortsova) visited the site of the accident. Twenty-nine people have been hospitalised. We should provide all necessary aid and do what is required.
As far as the investigation is concerned, it will run its course and I hope that the objective truth – who is to blame and what measure of responsibility should be borne – will soon be established.
Now let us look at our agenda. Today we are discussing roadmaps aimed at the accelerated development of new segments of the economy. We go on with this. At our last meeting, we talked about the tasks facing us in biotechnology and gene engineering. Today we will discuss the development of information technology.
It is clear that the introduction of modern information technology influences labour productivity and quality of life, helps to reduce the work involved in governance, including in the management of the main social processes and transportation, and, of course, also improves the quality of state services and brings medicine and education to a new level.
The development of the information technology (IT) sector largely determines the competitiveness of Russia. Currently, domestic software and service producers operate rather successfully on the domestic market, and they also have a presence on the global market. In 2012, software production volumes exceeded 75 billion roubles, and exports accounted for 60% of the total. Internet programming companies and those providing online services are developing rather quickly. In effect, Russia’s Internet market is the largest in Europe, and experts believe that it has an impressive growth potential. Some startup companies in this area have been recognised on the global market. By the way, leaders include the developers of mobile applications for modern systems that we use. On the whole, the national IT market grew by about 6% last year. However, Russian products account for only 0.6% of the global IT market, which is currently estimated at $1.7 trillion. Of course, this is very little. At the same time, imported products meet virtually the entire domestic-market demand for essential equipment. I repeat, equipment, not software packages. This includes mobile devices, telecommunications equipment and office equipment.
D.Medvedev: In 2018, the number of high-productivity IT jobs will double and exceed 600,000 people. Production and exports of domestic goods and services will double.
Of course, there needs to be a breakthrough in the IT sector. We must improve education levels in the IT sphere, including the use of distance and online education options. We must expand research in this area at domestic higher educational institutions and research agencies and also by establishing new world-class research centres. We must improve new mechanisms for supporting IT businesses and for exporting high-tech Russian products. In this way, the IT sector must grow at least three times faster than GDP. We have the right to expect this. In 2018, the number of high-productivity IT jobs will double and exceed 600,000 people. Production and exports of domestic goods and services will double. This is the first issue.
Here is another issue, which has to do with the development of national insurance companies. We are talking all the time about the need to develop the insurance sector, including harvest insurance. We have recently discussed this issue. But this draft law aims to sign more electronic online contracts and to allow insurance companies to do this under simplified procedures.
It will work as follows. The customer will file an application with his electronic signature through the insurance company’s website, the company will then send him a contract, which will come into effect once the customer pays the insurance premium.
The use of electronic documents has become the norm in the services market. Processing insurance claims and document exchange in loss settlements has been one of the most popular services in Russia. Simplifying it should improve the quality of insurance services and increase the number of people using these types of insurance.
Another issue that I would like to address is the distribution of this year’s subsidies under the federal targeted programme for education development to 2015 as part of the Our New School national education initiative. As you know, this initiative was launched in 2011. The subsidies are provided to 36 regions, which have been selected on a competitive basis. In total, 846 million roubles in subsidies will be allocated.
These funds will help create additional professional development opportunities for teachers and senior managers in the education system. They will be also used to increase access to kindergartens through various types of pre-school education facilities, to introduce new educational standards in schools, to support programmes for gifted children, to improve medical care, and to facilitate interaction with families on issues related to their children’s education and development.
It is also planned to establish resource and technical support centres for schools to provide them with IT and e-learning resources. In fact, the road map that I mentioned earlier also includes support for the school Olympiad movement in the field of information technology. This is quite useful, especially considering that our students usually perform very well at these Olympiads, and this is our future.
Let’s move on to the first item on the agenda – the draft road map on IT development. Mr Nikiforov, go ahead please.
Nikolai Nikiforov: Mr Medvedev, colleagues. The IT industry plays a key role in the development of the national economy and ensuring national security. Today, the industry produces over 250 billion roubles worth of products, includes 300,000 high-tech jobs, and exports $4 billion in products.
The IT sector significantly helps increase productivity in all sectors of the economy. It has been the driving force of the Government’s efforts to diversify the economy and stimulate economic growth. We need a systemic approach by the Government to the development of IT industry. This approach is outlined in the roadmap on the development of the IT industry in 2013-2018. It has been reviewed and submitted for the Government’s consideration.
This document has been developed in accordance with the President’s instruction as part of his address to the Federal Assembly, and has been agreed with all relevant federal executive agencies and development institutions. The document was also approved by the Government Expert Council during a discussion at the Open Government. The Expert Council noted the document is well planned. You have a presentation on this issue in front of you. As you can see on the third slide, we are not trying to develop an IT industry from scratch. Russia has built up a considerable foundation which we can further expand and develop the industry.
N.Nikiforov: "Today, the industry produces over 250 billion roubles worth of products, includes 300,000 high-tech jobs, and exports $4 billion in products."
Russian IT companies and products are among the leaders of the European and global markets. Perhaps not all companies shown on the slide are familiar to audience members, but IT professionals in most countries know them well. The capitalisation of a company such as Yandex exceeds $10 billion and Mail.ru (also shown on the slide) about $8 billion. This is the level of performance indicators that we are now talking about.
In addition, Russia also has a fair number of medium-sized companies, which allows us to take a comprehensive approach to this industry without having to focus on any particular field. Notably, there are no truly global players in Russia that can boast revenues in the tens of billions of dollars. All these factors were included in the road map.
The IT sector will be developed in the following key areas in the period from 2013 to 2018.
First, IT research and development. This will make a significant contribution to the industry. Unlike in physics or mathematics, we don’t have any strong IT research teams by international standards.
Second, the development and improvement of infrastructure, including the physical, material component, such as public and private technology parks, and the organisational component, such as measures that will support software exports.
Third, developing an IT personnel training system that should provide a high level of admissions to higher and secondary specialised educational institutions, and supply the IT sector with enough properly trained staff.
Fourth, improving the institutional environment for doing business in the IT industry. This will allow us to keep IT research under Russian jurisdiction by creating an attractive business environment. In addition, efforts will be made to ensure accurate statistical records in the industry and to improve the process of certifying IT companies. It's no secret that the current statistics often confuse pure information technology and communications, and occasionally even the entire industry and, for example, transport.
To improve the state’s systemic approach to developing the IT industry, we will develop and submit to the Government a separate strategy – The Strategy for the Development of IT Industry, 2013-2020 and to 2025. Key activities under the road map and the strategy will be included in the corresponding subprogramme of the state programme Information Society.
The level of development of the information technology industry is largely dependent on the amount of research and development. In this regard, in conjunction with the Ministry of Education and Science, we plan to create, with the participation of the state, up to 50 breakthrough research centres in the field of IT at our higher education institutions and research centres, and to facilitate the formation of new R&D centres led by international companies in Russia.
With regard to infrastructure development, an ecosystem designed to boost the development of the IT industry has been partially established in Russia. It includes technology parks, venture capital firms, funding and lending institutions, and other elements of business support. In the coming years, the efforts of federal executive bodies and development institutions will focus on completing this ecosystem and improving its performance.
For example, in 2015, the construction of all the technology parks that were started under the state programme should be completed and brought up to full capacity. Their combined area totals some 350,000 square metres, and the number of industrial parks stands at 11, at least. This alone will create at least 25 thousand high-tech jobs. In addition, we will take measures to support Russian IT exports and promote Russian IT companies’ presence on the international markets. Using the open data mechanism, which is also being discussed by the Government, we will help companies create new services and open up new opportunities for them. It will also promote the industry and start-ups.
N.Nikiforov: "In conjunction with the Ministry of Education and Science, we plan to create, with the participation of the state, up to 50 breakthrough research centres in the field of IT at our higher education institutions and research centres."
The IT industry is faced with a major shortage of specialists, even though salaries are high. The industry employs about 300,000 people. Another 700,000 IT specialists are engaged in the industry indirectly. They are working in other industries, but their activity is also IT-related. That’s about 1.4% of the total able-bodied population of Russia. But if we compare this figure with other countries, we'll see estimates that their share of IT specialists amounts to 3% or even 5%. The demand through 2018 is estimated at over 350,000 people. Of them, 150,000, as we understand, will be trained using the budget funds provided by the Ministry of Education and Science. This leaves us with a shortage of about 200,000 people. The Ministry of Communications in conjunction with the Ministry of Education will submit proposals on how to overcome this shortage to the Government.
We can say tentatively that the provision of the IT industry with properly trained personnel is expected to be achieved through the development of professional training, promotion of the IT industry, and improving IT literacy. Along with activities designed to increase quantity, we must, of course, ensure proper quality in training and develop professional educational standards for IT specialties, open departments of IT companies at higher education institutions and departments of higher education institutions at IT companies. There are isolated examples of such cooperation, but we believe that it should be a common practice.
The roadmap incorporates a nationwide plan to upgrade the computer literacy of the general public, including the elderly.
Olympiads, contests and competitions in the IT sector will be organised and measures will be taken to promote IT, especially among young people.
Russia today offers an institutional framework for IT business that is comparable to that of many developed countries in terms of comfort and attractiveness. However, in order to make Russia still more competitive in the global IT arena, that framework needs to be improved. One way to do that could be to reduce the insurance premiums for IT companies that employ between 7 and 29 people. They currently cover companies with a staff of 30 and more, but we believe that during the stipulated period when benefits will be offered, it is growing startups above all that need to be supported.
N.Nikiforov: "Iin 2015, the construction of all the technology parks that were started under the state programme should be completed and brought up to full capacity. Their combined area totals some 350,000 square metres, and the number of industrial parks stands at 11, at least. This alone will create at least 25 thousand high-tech jobs."
Improving legislation in the field of cloud computing. This area is also in need of a legal framework and it can be a market niche for our companies. Besides, there is the issue of simplifying work with options within Russian jurisdiction. This issue has been pointed out by practically all the market players, and we are preparing some additional draft laws and other regulations in this area.
To upgrade the quality control process in IT development the mechanisms for statistical monitoring and accreditation of IT companies will be improved.
The implementation of the roadmap will help achieve some important targets, including a high rate for the development and growth of the industry. We have set the following targets: the IT sector must grow 3 times faster than the gross domestic product in the country as a whole; output must increase from 250 to 450 billion roubles; exports should double (to 9 billion dollars a year); venture financing must reach 40 billion roubles – we have already mentioned the 50 research centres. And as a more general task we believe that IT professions should be among the most popular, considering the contribution they make to the industry in general.
N.Nikiforov: "The IT sector must grow 3 times faster than the gross domestic product in the country as a whole; output must increase from 250 to 450 billion roubles; exports should double (to 9 billion dollars a year); venture financing must reach 40 billion roubles."
In light of the agreed position of federal executive bodies, development institutions and the expert community I urge you to approve the proposed roadmap for IT development by passing the relevant Government resolution.
Dmitry Medvedev: Thank you. Just a small question. You mentioned cloud computing. Are regulatory acts being passed on this topic?
Nikolay Nikiforov: Yes, our Ministry is passing regulatory acts so that we know exactly how data is being processed and what additional responsibilities arise in this connection. This will contribute to the more active use of the technology in the daily work of our legal entities, especially small businesses.
Dmitry Medvedev: Do other countries have them?
Nikolay Nikiforov: I think we will in many ways be the trailblazers in laying down this legal framework. Everybody is talking about it, but there is no effective regulatory…
Dmitry Medvedev: I just think that it does not exist anywhere, not even in the United States, which was the pioneer…
Nikolay Nikiforov: Nevertheless these issues must be addressed.
Dmitry Medvedev: Very well, I understand. Tradition dictates that we bring in an expert to comment on the key topic. I give the floor to Albert Yefimov, Director of the Skolkovo Information Technology Cluster.
Albert Yefimov: Thank you very much. Good morning everyone.
The Government’s Expert Council has discussed the draft roadmap for the development of information technology. The expert community, consisting of representatives of large, well-known and small Russian companies, has taken part in the discussion of the proposed documents. The Telecommunications Ministry has organised meetings and sessions of expert panels that have revealed a spectrum of opinions which formed the basis of the document before you. The level of mutual understanding between the industry, the state and the engagement of experts was very high, an opinion shared by all the experts.
The discussion of the roadmap at such an early stage involving top experts is an approach that should always be used in developing such comprehensive and systemic documents as the roadmap. This is particularly important for innovation-driven areas because we need to give thought from the very beginning to the measures we use to channel our efforts into developing ground-breaking technologies.
On the whole, all the experts have noted the great importance of the document and the thorough way in which it has been prepared and they recommend that it should be adopted. But there are a couple of things we would like to draw your attention to. Firstly, experts in every meeting stressed the need to have a short but clear list of technological areas that the state is planning to support over the coming 10 years. These areas could include such technologies as mobile broadband internet applications, big data, robotics, new man-computer interfaces, etc. For the people who work in the sector it is very important to get a signal as to what will be needed in the next 10 years. Our colleagues from the Telecommunications Ministry have assured us that it will be included in the next strategy to be developed, but we thought we should flag it up anyway.
The next important issue is the funding of innovative companies and their projects. Interest-free loans and bank guarantees are widespread forms of financing across the world. Unfortunately, this form of financing is virtually non-existent in Russia and we believe it should be promoted. The current version of the roadmap envisages the creation of these mechanisms, but only by the end of 2016. We think it should be done much sooner, starting now.
Nikolay Nikiforov in his presentation mentioned open data. We agree that open data is the driver of IT growth and the roadmap should include our proposal to develop measures to encourage the appearance of innovative startups and companies that are implementing socially significant projects in this field.
On the strength of the above, we would like to see the members of the Government’s Expert Council and the Telecommunications Ministry Expert Council invited regularly to take part in reviewing the implementation of the roadmap, assessing the implementation and making corrections where necessary. We propose to add the following to the protocol decision.
First. The Ministry of Economic Development and the Finance Ministry are to develop proposals to encourage individuals and legal entities to finance companies involved in research and development, to offer easy access to finance from financing institutions for these companies at an early stage in their development, and to develop a mechanism of issuing loans and state bank guarantees.
Second. The Telecommunications Ministry, jointly with the Ministry of Economic Development, the Ministry of Industry and Trade and the Ministry of Education and Science, is to develop and agree with the expert community a list of priority areas of technological development in the development strategy for information technology. That is all I have to say.
Dmitry Medvedev: Thank you. Colleagues, does anyone have anything to add? Vladimir Fortov, please.
Vladimir Fortov (President of the Russian Academy of Sciences): Mr Medvedev, the Academy of Sciences has considered these documents and we think they are very timely and relevant, we support them of course, but we have several remarks. The main remark is that as you all know, the information sector depends heavily on scientific achievements, and that applies equally to hardware and software. This is an area where scientific results are introduced in practice faster than in any other area. The firm Intel, for example, spends 50% of its profits on research and development, which allows it to control the world market. This, of course, should be our goal as well, and we welcome the fact that the road map envisages the creation of 50 new centres. But we should not forget the existing potential; I am referring to the network of institutes the Academy of Sciences already has, and they have teams at the Kurchatov Institute that are doing some ground-breaking work, but they are not mentioned in the text of the document.
There are some priority areas. They include Big Data, work with large amounts of data, which was briefly mentioned. The use of super computers for forecast modeling is a very important area. Today super computers operate in the petaflop range, and, say, in defence-related research in the United States experiments cannot be started without first conducting modeling on super computers. This applies to nuclear and conventional weapons, aviation and transport safety, and many other areas. We have done some good work on that. You see, the rule in IT business and IT activities is that hardware plus software equals a constant. This means that if you have a bad machine you usually have good mathematical support. Because our machines have never been all that good our mathematical support has always been of a very high standard. Our mathematicians still win the most prestigious Fields Medal and so on. This potential exists at the Academy of Sciences and at the Kurchatov Institute, and it would be a very good idea to use it. I would suggest that this aspect receive an appropriate amount of attention.
The other side has to do with hardware. We are witnessing what has become a permanent revolution in physics, with new calculation principles being introduced, for example, quantum computers. The science of spinorics studies the behaviour of a single electron in the state of spin. This is relevant to super-miniature systems, biocybernetics and much else that merits attention. Why? If something new appears it can be brought to market faster because everyone is in the same starting state. Therefore we see some promise there, we do not have to lag behind forever.
And my last point. The topic is not new in this country. It is important, of course, it has strategic implications. Have the authors of this document analysed the causes of our failures and setbacks in the past? Have conclusions been drawn? I would like to draw your attention to this. If not, we should understand where we went wrong when we launched these ambitious projects and why the effect is 0.6%, as you, Mr Medvedev, have said. Thank you.
Dmitry Medvedev: Thank you, Mr Fortov, for your comments on this document. Mr Topilin is next.
Maksim Topilin (Minister of Labour and Social Protection): Mr Medvedev, esteemed colleagues, I have a small suggestion. Nikolai Nikiforov mentioned plans to bring down the threshold of the number of employees that entitles a company to reduced insurance rates from 30 to seven. This proposal is indeed under consideration. The budgets for 2014, 2015 and 2016 do not envisage this funding. We are talking about 4-5 billion roubles, and the sum is supposed to increase over time. I would suggest, if possible, that this item on page 18 state the lowering of the threshold not as an accomplished fact, but as an issue that needs further consideration so as not to put a full stop. Thank you.
Dmitry Medvedev: Of course this is possible. It is only a road map. Mr Siluanov, please.
Anton Siluanov (Minister of Finance): Thank you. I would like to speak in the same vein. When people speak about the need to support IT companies, they often propose continuing the policy of reduced insurance premiums. These companies will pay 14% until 2017, while all the other companies pay 30%. Beginning from 2018 and until 2020 these premiums are to be equalised. From the legislative point of view I would like to say the following. If we are talking about reducing the number of employees in companies entitled to these benefits from 30 to seven, i.e. the range of application of these benefits is greatly expanded – if we follow this road we should put a full stop on it and stop discussing the continuation of the policy of preserving reduced insurance premiums. Why? Because these are indeed shortfalls of the Pension Fund incomes. We always say that everyone should form insurance premiums independently. We discontinue previously established benefits, this is the point. For a whole number of sectors we have set the deadline when reduced insurance premiums cease to be applied. Incidentally, reduced insurance premiums have been introduced for a long period, until 2020, and we and the Labour Ministry believe this deadline and these rates should not be revised. In principle, we are ready to consider reducing the number of employees from 30 to seven for a company to be eligible for these benefits, but we should on no account revise the premiums, because that would upset the whole strategy of the pension reform that we are developing.
Dmitry Medvedev: Thank you, Mr Siluanov. Would you like to say something? (Addressing Arkady Dvorkovich, Deputy Prime Minister)
Arkady Dvorkovich: Thank you. First, about the roles of the state and business in the development of information technologies. As I see it – and we have discussed this at our meetings – the state should, on the one hand, stimulate business to expand its activities in this sphere, and tax benefits are an important element of that. I am referring to insurance premium benefits connected with pension, medical and other insurance, because the share of the wage fund in the overall costs for these companies is between 40 and 70%. That is way above the figures in most other sectors of the economy. There are similar instances, but they are relatively few, for example, editorial offices of newspapers and some other types of activities. For the most part the share of the wage fund in all other sectors is between 5 and 15%, and accordingly the load as regards insurance premiums is different.
If these benefits are withdrawn, this business in Russia will never assume such a scale and nobody will receive any premiums, neither the Pension Fund, nor the Health Insurance Fund nor the Social Insurance Fund. We would have to forget about these amounts. The business would survive on some scale but not on the scale we would like it to be, considering the stiff competition on this market. Companies will manage to pay less anyway by using outsourcing and various other ways of tax optimisation. The principle of “every man for himself” is valid, but it can be voluntary or it can be mandatory. With us it is mandatory. That distorts the philosophy of insurance.
Dmitry Medvedev: What do you suggest?
Arkady Dvorkovich: I propose that benefits be expanded by reducing the threshold from 30 to seven employees. I have already made this decision at the conciliation meeting.
Dmitry Medvedev: I see.
Arkady Dvorkovich: The Labour Ministry and the Finance Ministry objected, but still. Second, I propose extending the effective period of the benefits, perhaps with some corrections. You see, there is pension insurance and there is medical social insurance. They are run differently, in other words, the nature of insurance principles differs in the healthcare and pension systems, therefore the size of premiums companies have to pay must be connected with the type of insurance.
A.Dvorkovich: "I propose the following: the state should focus on infrastructure projects in the IT sphere, and of course, the support of fundamental research and stimulating the business involved in this work."
As regards the pay-as-you go system, other solutions and support mechanisms are possible. The state should concentrate (not to repeat past mistakes, when we embarked on ambitious projects) on creating an infrastructure for the information technology sector and not actually implement IT projects. Infrastructure means above all broadband access to the internet, where we do not actually have a programme, or rather, there is no sub-programme in the state programme. There are serious risks involved in achieving the target of spreading broadband access throughout the country and with regard to super computer technologies, where the state also plays a certain role. We have passed decisions on Sarov, the Kurchatov Institute and Moscow State University, but there has been no decision concerning the following period, for the medium term, and it has yet to be worked out in the framework of the current budget cycle.
I propose the following: the state should focus on infrastructure projects in the IT sphere, and of course, the support of fundamental research and stimulating the business involved in this work.
Dmitry Medvedev: Thank you. Yes, please.
Mikhail Shmakov (Chairman of the Russian Independent Trade Union Federation): Mr Medvedev, esteemed colleagues. The development of information technologies is, of course, a very important issue and I think the Minister has given us a very clear idea of what has to be done. As for contributions to the pension, healthcare and social insurance funds, if we are to follow the proposals made, we must free these companies from having to make these contributions and tell them and the people working there that they may use only paid medicine and have no right to free medicine. They must then be taken off the standard pension insurance scheme and adopt a different pension system for them. In the same way they may not draw temporary disability allowances unless they follow the general rules set by the state. Their benefits can be extended, but if the federal budget pays for them into social funds, this could go on forever. If the federal budget has no cash to pay into these insurance funds for these people, they must purchase everything as part of a full scheme.
Dmitry Medvedev: Thank you, Mr Shmakov. Let us wind up here. If there is anything important, Ms Golodets, please go ahead. It is good that we are discussing this subject in detail.
Olga Golodets: Mr Medvedev, colleagues. Regarding pensions and other insurance contributions, the point is that we are working within existing legislation and the legislation which we are developing and laying as a foundation for all changes. It is all the same to the social sphere and people in general where the money comes from – directly from the people or from the budget. If we accept the proposal being touted by the economic sector that a certain industry needs additional support, then we should see clearly that the budget has resources to compensate for the shortfall in revenue and to guarantee people payment of the contributions we are talking about. Whatever we may say about some sections of the population resorting to private medicine, we have no people who are saying no to state services, the state ambulance service, state hospitalisation and so on. Even people who are strict adherents of private medicine also use state services. So the issue of additional funding for this is very important.
Second. We mentioned in passing that IT technology must raise the level of government services for ordinary people in such areas as education, healthcare and so on. We have in hand a series of projects designed to simplify the rendering of education and healthcare services and make them more transparent: these are e-document services, healthcare e-cards and pre-school waiting lists, which will be transparent across the whole of Russia. We are pinning great hopes on the quality of this work and on this programme.
Dmitry Medvedev: Thank you, Ms Golodets.
It is good that these issues evoke real interest among members of the Government and other colleagues because this is the future of our country.
Now I’d like to go back to what was said previously, particularly in the report by our expert Albert Ruvimovich. I would like to say that I support the idea of compiling a list of technologies we are focusing on. This is not an attempt to anticipate developments, it is just a desire to position ourselves and set priorities right. We did the same when the modernisation commission was at work and when, for example, we set aside supercomputers as a separate sector – something which was very effective. I believe that it would be right to do this here, so let us note this in our protocol decision and for the future.
As far as incentives are concerned, something we have discussed at length, in general they should be used. Of course, we must bear in mind the sources of compensation and other aspects. But if we fail to put accents right and if we proceed only from what the market rules, then we will have no breakthroughs. But we actually have good opportunities to make advancements in this area.
Mr Fortov spoke of hardware and software. The situation with hardware is not very good, of course, but there are some prospects. Perhaps we should focus in particular on this sector. As regards software, our global standing here is not bad. This position must be consolidated, of course, as must the efforts to develop supercomputers which must be used on a broad scale by businesses and industry. A few years ago (sad as it was), not a single aircraft and not a single ship in this country was computer-designed, everything was done on the drawing boards. How are we going to sell them? No self-respecting nation, no buyer, will purchase an aircraft designed using old standards. True, going digital calls for effort, money and computer technology. But this is important. In this sense I fully support what Mr Fortov said about drawing on Russian Academy of Sciences institutes. Their potential must be tapped by all means.
As for our setbacks, where do they stem from? I do not know if this road map has room to analyse this … People here have said that the state, rather than just commanding, should create conditions for development, and this seems right to me. To be honest, our failings are also due to a certain lack of possibilities: we never invested heavily in these areas. The chances emerged perhaps three, five or seven years ago. However, it’s not all bad. I have read in a recent report that Russia has moved to fifth place among global economies in GDP, jostling ahead of Germany. The World Bank believes our GDP is bigger than Germany’s. I do not know which methods they used to make their calculations (perhaps the purchasing power parity), but the report makes gratifying reading.
As for evening out rates, I would like to make sure we do not shut the door on any opportunities. I understand there may be a sense that certain decisions are just or unjust, but I am saying once again that we must handle our priorities expertly and so I would like to have this road map keep all possible options open, including the right to choose graded rates (I am referring to reduced rates), and make cuts in staff numbers, as was mentioned. But the final conclusions will be drawn depending on how well things pan out with respect to our financial possibilities. So this should be seen as a direction which we will be able to support. A final decision is yet to be taken because there is still some time left.
Taking into account what has been said, I propose the draft resolution should be approved and the protocol decision amended. Do you agree? Accepted.
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